You also said that it was fine if the president didn’t need you now. That was a very strong message.
A very strong statement with a moral message. (But) it wasn’t a battle call.
Not a threat?
Not at all. (It’s) a moral message.
NasDem also rejected the proposed extension of the presidential term. Which strained your relationship (with Jokowi): Anies’ nomination or the presidential term?
If my analysis is not wrong, the rejection against Anies’ nomination is stronger. There are no other issues causing our relation a bit tense.
Are you interested in fixing it?
I am friends (with him). We meet. I feel we must have mutual respect. If possible, we should preserve existing friendships whether you are still officials or not. That’s more honorable. It means there will be problems if we come with bitterness, anger or vengeance. It’s not fair if we harbor our anger just because we were not invited (to the gathering at the Palace).
Is Jokowi concerned about Anies’ candidacy?
I hope Pak Jokowi is bigger than that. He can be a great leader. When he opens his mind, he also has a huge vision. He must also have a great soul.
Including accepting Anies’ nomination?
Who is Anies actually? Isn’t he an Indonesian citizen? Doesn’t he still have political rights? These two questions are very fundamental questions. Why should we nominate him if his citizenship and political rights have been revoked?
Is it true that you promised Jokowi that Anies would continue Jokowi’s program if he became president?
I think it goes without saying that given the personal understanding of both of us. I want to see good development programs continue but I will make adjustments if they should not be continued. With all the arduous efforts he made, I’m sure President Jokowi has already laid the foundation for the development programs to progress at an accelerated pace. Why can’t we welcome that? Let us not act as if there’s no room for correction. I think we are quite naive.
NasDem is under pressure because the communication minister has had a run-in with the law?
I take it as something normal. There’s an ongoing case at a district attorney’s office. Go ahead. I hope it’s just a purely legal case.
Is there any possibility that it’s not just a legal case?
I hope it’s a pure legal case.
Will NasDem withdraw all of its cabinet members if one of them is dismissed in the reshuffle?
It’s best to maintain trust among us. I hope that more than anything else. Once (the trust) is gone, perhaps it will be extremely difficult. Not all political parties use the same rhythm, model and management style. I offer ideas as a party institution that are not necessarily easy for the public to digest, understand, let alone believe. One of the operational implementations that I propose is politics without ‘dowry’. Who believes in that? That means I stand by the rejection (of parties generating) potential revenues of above Rp1 trillion.
Read the Full Interview in Tempo English Magazine
